More Comments from a Former Student

-from P

Have you been to one of these centers? I attended the one in Pittsburgh. The conditions were horrible. You are constantly stressed and they will warn you of potential gang fights in the lunch room. Maybe if the 25k per student (based on only 8 months or attendance?) were put towards hiring quality instructors and putting together actual libraries, computers, and other tools needed for the students, it wouldn’t be such a failure.

Almost 8 years after completing the Culinary program there, I am now enrolled in college for Photography. I can tell you that Job Corps is about the people contracted to run them making the most profit. They do almost nothing for those of us who are actually living in their little hell holes.

If it really costs that much, perhaps they should offer that 25k to people who meet the requirements as a grant for higher education? Maybe they should put together a better program? I agree, it is a waste.

-from Job Corps Fraud

For those of us who actually worked at a Job Corps Center WE KNOW what are you talking about. First of all, the “good” teachers don’t stay. They find out very soon that it’s not at all about the “quality of education” one gives the students, it’s who can most effectively manipulate the numbers in order to reach required monthly goals. And, most of the people in management who were setting the unattainable goals had little or no professional education or even knew what it mean to “educate”. Please read the section on “Our Stories” to see how I tried to cope without proper tools or facilities to teach. It was enormously frustrating to have no one listen when you asked for the minimum to get by in order to do your job.

Filed under: Comments, Job Corps, Job Corps Centers, Pittsburg Job Corps Center, Reader's Comments, gang fights, Job Corps, Pittsburg Job Corps, Readers comments

Reader’s Controversial Comments About Martin Gross’s Statements

These are few comments from yesterday’s post about Martin Gross’s interview and “Job Corps  and the Government Racket”.  I remain fascinated that Job Corps supporters and detractors are so passionately polarized.  Having worked in two different Job Corps Centers: Shriver in Devens, MA and Kittrell, NC I feel aptly qualified to say I saw for myself the waste, inefficiency and focus on numbers to the detriment of the students. I am thinking that Job Corps most passionate defenders have never worked inside a Job Corps Center? I can’t believe that anyone would have been an employee and still wholeheartedly defend its purpose.  Only an outsider, not privy to the inner workers of these contractor cash cows would make a statement such as the following:

-from Marianne

So many good kids take advantage of the Job Corps opportunity, do the hard work, follow the rules, get their GEDs or HS diplomas and tech certifications. Any good program has its failures, detractors and disappointments. But Job Corps is just about the only safe place left for youth who have fallen through the cracks of school & society.

Even on the most poorly-run center – and there are some, as well as superbly-run centers – the program works for kids who take it seriously. And on every single center there are dedicated staff who love the kids, believe in them, and love their jobs. Why? Because the program works, the opportunity is there, and it’s a great second chance for tens of thousands of kids each year.

Win some, lose some. At Job Corps there are more winners than losers by far. I dare you to prove otherwise!!

-from Andrea, Job Corps Fraud

We do not dispute that there are success stories from Job Corps. However, there are two sides to every story and the “other side” of Job Corps must be told. There is too much propoganda and illusions about this program in the press today. Please, I urge you to click around this site and read research studies done by scientists and reputable economists who have studied Job Corps extensively. Instead of challenging me, read the factual reports on this site. Thanks so much. I think the site speaks for itself. Andrea for Job Corps Fraud

-from Nancy

Exactly whose butt are you trying to KI##,  the Job Corps have had historically SUCH a LOW %%% of success that it DOES NOT make any of them worth the money that spent on them.  Stop drinking the Kool Aid, and WAKE UP.  And STOP most importantly condoning STEALING from honest tax payers by this program.

-from Harold

Marianne,

“I dare you to prove otherwise!!” ? Just look at the statistical reports, the OMS10, which is bogus anyway, and you will see the proof right there. If the statistics weren’t manipulated for that report, the results would be even worse.

Andrea is correct – unless you have worked in the system, as I have for many years, you have no idea what is really going on.

“Only safe place left” – I’ve been on centers where students rioted, assaults and beat-downs were common, gang activity flourished, drugs were rampant, and even a death occurred. These centers are not as safe as you might want people to believe. They are understaffed, especially after class and on week-ends, when most of the negative behavior happens. If you knew where to look for student accounts of what goes on “after hours” you would see the truth.

Marianne, you seem to be someone who wants to present a different picture of Job Corps to the public. Be honest, are you a contractor, a parent or a naive employee who doesn’t see the forest for the trees? Maybe you have a job at a Job Corps because you have a political patronage job and are protected for awhile anyway. If you are an employee, save your money – chances are your day will come and you will be unemployed too like so many others.

Filed under: Employees, Job Corps, Job Corps Centers, Kittrell Job Corps Center, Reader's Comments, Shriver Job Corps Center, Job Corps, Job Corps Employees, Kittrell Job Corps, Martin Gross, Readers comments, Shriver Job Corps

Reader’s Comments About Roy Adams and Shriver Job Corps Center

These are the responses a reader had about the post, Greed Never Takes a Holiday Meet Roy Adams of Adams and Associates:

-from Tim

“I’ll never forget the summer dress code memo Roy Adams sent out. There was a question on what was appropriate attire when the students were gone and the staff were attending required trainings, or clean-up work in preparation of the next round of student arrivals. Capri pants were forbidden for the women, although I previously worked in two Fortune 500 companies where they were allowed unless the employees were out in the field meeting customers or dealing with the general public. Ties were required year-round for the male employees, although the manager in the office next to mine never wore one, and seemed to get away with it. The memo ended with the statement “No tie, no job”. As if an additional clothing accessory in the heat of summer would lead to greater productivity or increased funding from Congress.

-from Tim

Another dress code situation at Shriver that wasn’t an issue but should have been was the summer attire of one of the program directors. She had this yellow baby-doll pajama outfit that she called a “sun dress” that had a hemline that practically reached her hip line! She neither had the body stature nor figure for an outfit like this, but she strutted around like a supermodel and appeared to enjoy the attention. This resulted in a lot of remarks by other staff members as to the definition of what was acceptable in the workplace. The male students had previously nicknamed her “Milkshake” after the song by Kelis Jones, so it’s a good thing that she had the sense not to wear this when school was actually in session. The center director saw absolutely nothing wrong with wearing an outfit like this, yet the men would be chastised if they did not wear a tie when it was 90 degrees in the shade and none of the students were present. I was lucky enough to have an office in one of the few air-conditioned buildings, but it was still difficult to do the required clean-up work in preparation for the next school session if you felt like you had a noose around your neck.

This same center director put another program director on a 90 day corrective action plan without telling Human Resources. This meant that the monthly HR reports I had to send to the regional corporate office were incorrect for three months in a row. After I left, she fired yet another program director who was able to appeal her termination to the corporate office and get her job back. This is the only incident I was aware of in two years of employment where a termination decision actually got overturned. With the exception of this and a high level director who had been fired shortly after 11 years of employment, all of the center director’s direct reports were puppets. The only managerial authority she allowed them would be to take their word as gospel if a situation arose where mediation or objectivity could have been offered by a second party to make a fair and rational decision.

My final dialogue with the center director involved a situation where it was my word against one of her direct reports. When she indicated that I could have met with her privately to discuss the problem before it escalated, I didn’t even respond. I knew it would have been pointless. The decision was already made seconds after the incident happened.

On my last day I participated in the quarterly new hire orientation program. It was held in my office. The center director gave her required welcoming introduction to the new employees, gave a brief but thorough history of Adams and Associates, and explained all policies and procedures, including the Job Corps mission of preparing students for and assisting them in finding jobs in the workplace. When one of the new hires stated that the present economy was so bad that there were no jobs out there and that college graduates were currently having difficulty finding employment, she abruptly replied “I don’t want to hear that!”

Their priorities are screwed up beyond repair. It’s a shame, because the Job Corps program was founded with the best intentions. It’s the contractors who are damaging it.

Filed under: Adams and Associates, Comments, Contractors, Job Corps, Job Corps Centers, Shriver Job Corps Center, Adams and Associates, dress code, Job Corps, Readers comments, Roy Adams, Shriver Job Corps Center

Reader’s Comments About Job Corps 6/17/2010

Regarding St. Petersburg Job Corps Center and the forty million dollar question…

-Allison

“Call the Atlanta Job Corps Regional Office to find out why the center is still empty, or better yet, the National Job Corps Director, Edna Primrose. Or maybe the Secretary of Labor.

With Edna Primrose as Director,  just wait and see how many contracts end up going to Adams and Associates.”

Regarding Oneonta and Iroquois Job Corps Centers and Education and Training Resources Corp:

-Josephine

“How is the latest contractor doing at Oneonta?  ETR is the same company that runs Iroquois Job Corps and the Corporate Liaison for Oneonta is the same person who oversaw Iroquois for the last five years – and we know all about the complaints under her watch at Iroquois.

This 2008 article just quotes the same concerns that have been in existence since Oneonta Job Corps opened about thirty yrs ago. Wake up Oneonta, nothing is going to change unless the taxpayer/voters decide to do something about it.

The conservative corporation that runs the center, ETR, will continue to fleece the taxpayers of this country because they can. Conservatives love to criticize “big government”, but they are first in line when it comes to handouts like Job Corps contracts.

They don’t give a damn about the population they serve, just the profits they can generate at taxpayer expense. Pigs at the trough.

We’ve all seen how government oversight and regulation work.  Just look at the mines, oil drilling, Arizona border issues, the big banks, etc. Big business runs this country and buys off our legislators – Job Corps is just another symptom of our society run amuck.”

Filed under: conservative, Education and Training Resources (ETR), Job Corps Centers, Oneonta Job Corps Center, politics, Reader's Comments, St. Petersburg Job Corps, Adams and Associates, Atlanta Job Corps Regional Office, Edna Primrose, Education and Training Resources, ETR, National Job Corps Director, oil drilling, Oneonta Job Corps Center, Readers comments, St. Petersburg Job Corps Center

Readers Comments about Job Corps an Unfailing Record of Failure

“Here are three reasons why Job Corps enjoys continued funding:

1-  Job Corps provides jobs and economic stimulus dollars to economically deprived areas.

2-  Job Corps takes at-risk students off the street for awhile, thus hopefully reducing crime and unemployment in their home areas and perhaps providing some time to mature and get some academic and vocational training.

3-  Private contractors who are awarded contracts will be able to continue to provide contributions to political candidates and parties, and patronage jobs to supporters. They also provide economic support for their friends in terms of purchasing materials and services for the Job Corps centers they run. As many of their friends as possible are able to pig out at the trough.

You don’t hear much about reasons #1 and #2 and certainly nothing about reason #3, but it is a reality.

Our Congressional representatives don’t want to upset the political apple cart by defunding this so-called vocational training program for the economically disadvantaged.  For poor people, Job Corps is the equivalent of a prep school that helps them get the kids out of the house at tax payers’ expense.”

“ETR started using New Summit School, the Mississippi high school diploma program about three or four years ago. It was part of their number fudging scheme which helped them skyrocket in the national rankings. The amount of students receiving diplomas naturally increased dramatically. Unfortunately, ETR cares more about making themselves look good and lining their pockets than the students welfare. Many of these kids leave center with a false sense of accomplishment when in reality the bogus Mississippi diplomas are of no use to them.”

“Just this afternoon, not even one hour ago, a friend of mine told me that he tested two students on a college qualifying exam. Both students had recently graduated from a Job Corps that utilizes an online “Occupational Diploma”.

Both students scored at one third the qualifying levels in Math and Language Arts – in the 20 percentages. They were surprised that they had done so poorly. I’m not. This is the quality of educational results produced by Job Corps centers using on-line diploma-mill programs to grant diplomas.

I feel sorry for these kids who have been sold a bill of goods and don’t know any better.  The Job Corps system and the contractors should be held accountable for contributing to the dumbing down of our educational system and creating cognitively handicapped students who can’t pass a college entrance exam.”

Filed under: Comments, Education and Training Resources (ETR), Job Corps, number manipulation, Reader's Comments, ETR, Job Corps, Mississippi diploma, New Summit School, Readers comments